Knott County Kentucky Census Record notes: Bates & Hall families

Original Facebook post: Sunday, February 20, 2011.

Knott County Kentucky Census Record notes: Bates & Hall families
August 1992 search notes per Thursa (Halcomb-Nunley) Short

This ties to my Bates family line as Joseph and Mary A. Bates are parents to Andrew who’s father of Molene –my mother.

This ties to my Hall families as Nellie with husband/relationship with Dick Hall are parents of Sam hall father of Pemmie Hall mother of Zettie Bates  mother of Molene –my mother.

For added twist, of course no surprise, Nellie was married to William “Bill” as seen here and had children who are kin via the Bates side of my family; Nellie ties back to the Bates family via Hall ancestors in common.

No matter what tree branch I follow on my maternal side –I’m related to William and Nellie as noted on this census.


1900 Knott County Kentucky Census
               373. Bates, William  b Nov 1840  age 59 farmer
                              Nellie b Feb 1835 age 65 children 9; 7 living

1910 Knott County Kentucky Census
               112. Bates, William J.  age 70 married 42 years
                              Nellie age 75 3rd marriage, children 9; 6 living

               138. Bates, Joseph age 35 married 15 years farmer
                              Mary A. age 35 children 8; 8 living
                              Uriah age 12
                              Andrew age 10
                              Clarence age 9
                              Ernest age 7
                              Flora age 5
                              Mary A. age 3
                              Landis age 2
                              Tilden age 6/12

******************************************************
Updated note 01 FEB 2014.

     This is a picture I took of a picture my (Great) Aunt Rosie had been given of her parents -also the parents of my maternal great-grandparents.  I don't recall where she thought the original would have been,  but this would have been on a visit to her my mom & Granny Tudy Bates in the late 80s to the mid 90s.  Photo of Margaret Alice "Mary Alice" "Babe" (Vanover) and Joseph "Joe" Bates.

     In 1910, my maternal grandfather Andy Bates was 10 years old.  That's the age one of my sons is turning soon.  My, the world is certainly a different place than it was back then.  This is a picture of my maternal grandfather -Andrew J. "Andy" Bates on his front porch.  Wife of Zettie Walker "Tudy" (Johnson) Bates; son of Joe and Mary Alice (Vanover) Bates; father of Molene (Bates) Halcomb my mother.
   
     In the bottom left corner, I see the old clipboard.  This would have been taken before I would have started writing family story notes.  I wonder what list was being made on that board.  He is dressed in his Sunday clothes, he as a Preacher with the Old Regular Baptist.  Or, it could have been a picture taken before or after a funeral.
   

Floyd County Kentucky Census Record notes: Bill D Hall family search

Original Facebook posting: Saturday, February 19, 2011 at 10:51pm.

Floyd County Kentucky Census Record notes: Bill D Hall family search

August 1994 search per Thursa (Halcomb-Nunley) Short

This ties to my Bates family line as William is “Bill D/Dee Hall” where Bates & Johnson family lines lived and are buried in Knott Co KY.
Some might recognize Bill & Ansy/Ansa’s daughter “Pink” (Luanna, Anna) who was Joe Bates’ mother.
Joe is the father of Andy Bates, his daughter is my mother, Molene.

1850 Floyd Co KY Census
               280. Isaacs, William  age 54  b NC
Sarah  age 60  b VA
                 Hays, William age 27  b KY
  Hall, Ansey  age 27  b KY
Harrison  age 4  b KY
Sarah  age 2  b KY

(Not sure why I don’t have notes on 1860; might have not taken or records destroyed or I just didn’t find it to look through it.)

1870 Floyd Co KY Census
               61. Hall, William D.  age 49  b KY
                              Anza  age 49  b KY
                              Anna  age 19  b KY
                              Henry  age 17  b KY
                              Andrew  age 12  b KY
                              Elenor  age 7  b KY
                              Margaret  age 5  b KY
                 Isaacs, William  age 77  b NC
                              Sarah  age 87  b VA

1880 Floyd Co KY Census
               (entry number not legible)
               Hall, William D.  age 55  b KY  Dad born NC, Mom born VA, married
                              Luanzy age 52  b KY  Dad born NC, Mom born VA, married
               Bates, James  age 25  b KY  Dad born VA, Mom born KY, married
                              Eleanor  age 23  b KY  Dad born KY, Mom born KY, married
                              Elizabeth age 4  b KY
                              Louanzy M.  age 9/12  b KY

Harlan County Kentucky Marriages 1794-1870

Original Facebook post: Saturday, February 19, 2011 at 10:04pm.

Harlan County Kentucky Marriages 1794-1870
Published by: JoAnn Colbert Cioe doing business as The Researchers, Indianapolis, IN
A booklet 5x7 size I bought at a genealogy conference years ago.
______________________________________
Here’s a few:

Listed for grooms names: Cornett, Hall, Johnson, Short

Archibald Cornett and Elizabeth Creech  6 Jan 1851
Charles T. Cornett and Polly Creech  10 Jul 1850
John Cornett and Eliz. Hollbrook  30 Dec 1841
William Cornett and Nancy Lewis  7 Jan 1830
William Cornett and Sally Eversole  24 Dec 1868
Martha Cornett and Jane Crider  17 Dec 1870
Samuel Cornett and Rachael Jenkins  20 Dec 1861

Alfred Hall and Eliz. Lewis  19 Apr 1866
Alfred Hall and Polly Taylor  11 Mar 1827
Ezekiel Hall and Clem Branson  7 Mar 1833
Francis Hall and Esther Osborne  1 Jan 1858
Francis Hall and Esther Cawood  11 Mar 1858
Franklin Hall and Marion Saylor  14 Mar 1869
Franklin Hall and Betsy Anderson  17 Dec 1834
Hezekiah Hall and Sally Smith  27 Apr 1832
James Hall and Sally Pace  20 Mar 1818
James Hall, Jr. and Polly Hall  21 Dec 1856
LD Hall and Susan Wynn  10 Apr 1870
Melvin Hall and Susannah Short  2 Jan 1862
Nath Hall and Louisa Noe  22 Mar 1863
Preston Hall and Rebecca Magg  19 Feb 1836
William Hall and Sarah Ward  15 Oct 1859

Andrew Johnson and Nancy Burns  24 May 1844
David Johnson and Dicy Brock  19 Dec 1835
Ephraim Johnson and Frances Howard  2 Mar 1852
James Johnson and Dolly Parker  2 Jun 1842
James Johnson and Nancy Brock  4 Jun 1867
Rice M. Johnson and Phebe Howard  24 Aug 1833
Samuel Johnson and Sarah Burns  6 Mar 1859

James Short and Elizabeth Bingham  3 Mar 1865
James Short and Rebecca Bailey  10 Sep 1829
John Short and Ann Witt  19 Apr 1866
Jonathan Short and Nancy Hall  10 Jul 1856
John Short II and Lucinda Reece  25 Feb 1861

Carter County Kentucky Marriages 1838-1850

Original Facebook post: Saturday, February 19, 2011 at 9:26pm.

Carter County Kentucky Marriages 1838-1850
Published by: JoAnn Colbert Cioe doing business as The Researchers, Indianapolis, IN
______________________________________
This is a small booklet 5x7 size I picked up at a genealogy conference years ago.

Listed for grooms with names: Hall, Swearingen

Hall, Andrew J. –Mary Ann Jones  date not listed
Hall, Elkanah –Elizabeth Savage  19 Dec 1849
Hall, James –Matilda Fraley  6 Mar 1844
Hall, James –Susan Luck  15 Feb 1843

Swearingen, William –Elizabeth Davis  14 Sep 1848
Swearingen, William –Frances Hall  11 Feb 1845

Letcher County Kentucky Marriages 1843-1850

Original Facebook post: Saturday, February 19, 2011 at 8:46pm.

Letcher County Kentucky Marriages 1843-1850
Published by: JoAnn Colbert Cioe doing business as The Researchers, Indianapolis, IN
______________________________________

Here’s a few from a little paperback booklet 5x7 size I picked up at a genealogy conference a long time ago:

Listed for grooms with names: Bates, Cornett, Hall, Johnson, Short, Vanover

Bates, Henderson –Martha Robinson  24 Nov 1850
Bates, James –Elizabeth Adams  26 Feb 1843
Bates, John D. –Sarah Doldrige  12 May 1845
Bates, Uriah –Letty Adams  14 Oct 1849
     (Uriah & Letty are my ancestors)

Cornett, Stephen –Polly Polly  3 Dec 1848

Hall, Alexander –Rebecca Stergell  28 Dec 1848
Hall, Allen –Hanah Yonts  20 Apr 1847
Hall, Isom –Peggy Maggard  5 Dec 1847
Hall, James –Polly Cordell  5 Dec 1849
Hall, John –Peggy Skeen  20 Nov 1850
Hall, Reuben –Nancy Hall  24 Mar 1846
Hall, William –Mary Slone  4 Jun 1844

Johnson, John –Christene Reffit  8 Sep 1850
Johnson, William –Nancy Ashley  15 Jan 1848

Short, Alexander –Caroline Brooks  4 Oct 1845
Short, Alfred –Elizabeth Davis  21 Nov 1846
Short, David –Polly Cantrell  26 Aug 1849

Vanover, Eli –Olla Mullins  2 Mar 1848

Delivering the baby, and a few other tidbits about children of K & Pemmie Johnson

Original Facebook post: Wednesday, February 16, 2011 at 9:46pm.
by Thursa (Halcomb-Nunley) Short

Midwife

My Granny Zettie Walker “Tudy” (Johnson) Bates recalled in the early 1990s that it was that delivered a number of folks she grew up with and helped to deliver herself.

Here are a few notes I found on who was credited as the midwife or doctor on site when her siblings were born, the children of Caleb “K” and Angeline “Pemmie” (Hall) Johnson.

William “Wedd” Johnson was born 7 Jan 1902 at Millstone, Letcher Co KY and delivered by Liza Lucas.

Estill “Son” Johnson was born 17 Apr 1907 in Knott Co KY and delivered by Sal Perry. (She also said he was a sleepwalker.)

Lettie Johnson was born 11 Dec 1909 in Knott Co KY and delivered by Sal Perry.

Rosanna “Rosannie” Johnson was born 4 Nov 1913 in Knott Co KY and delivered by Sal Perry.
She also said Rosannie & Jack were married 12 May 1940 in Knott Co KY by Tom Caudill at Rosannie’s parents home.
She also said that in 1949, Rosannie was confined to a hospital in London KY for 6 months due to TB.
She also said that Doc Collier with help of Zettie delivered Rosannie’s twins, and Doc Kelly delivered baby Inez.

George Johnson was born 26 Feb 1917 in Knott Co KY and Mandy Caudill delivered him.

Calvin Johnson was born 5 May 1924 in Knott Co KY and French Caudill delivered him.

Caleb B. “K” and Angeline “Pemmie” (Hall) Johnson family notes

Original Facebook post: Sunday, February 13, 2011 at 11:28pm.

Caleb B. “K” and Angeline “Pemmie” (Hall) Johnson family notes

Angeline "Pemmie" (Hall) Johnson & husband Caleb B. "K" Johnson.
Note her converse sneakers -her usual style.
He had very, very poor eyesight always -if any of you knew of the reason,
please share as there are several descdants on this line that also have similar problem in varying degrees.

Caleb B. "K" Johnson
I do not know what "B" stands for -if you do PLEASE share.
Born 1 Mar 1872, Weeksbury, Floyd Co KY.
Died 26 Mar 1966, Kite, Knott Co KY. He always had very poor eyesight but never a diagnosis known (if you know of ...tales, PLEASE share them).
My Granny, Zettie Bates, his daughter, said he was a farmer & sold produce in the areas he lived. That I am aware he was not a coal miner.
He was raised in the Weeksbury KY area.
He's the son of Caleb Johnson & Mahala "Halley" (Justice/Jestice) Johnson. His father had a second marriage to Polly Whitacre & Zettie Bates had many tales & memories of Granny Polly.

Angeline "Pemmie" (Hall) Johnson
Born 05 Sep 1882 in Kite, Knott County, KY.
She died 23 Mar 1972, Knott County, KY. Her cause of death as best her daughter, Zettie (Johnson) Bates knew was ovarian cancer or a type of female cancer; it was never something you talked about -"female troubles". (If you have more details, PLEASE share.)
She attended the Mallie Church of the Indian Bottom Association of Old Regular Baptist.
She's the daughter of Samuel "Sam" Hall & Malinda "Lynn" "Linda" Johnson.

My maternal great-grandmother, Angeline "Pemmie" (Hall) Johnson.
It's on the porch of her house at the head of Bill D Holler near Kite, Knott Co KY.
Just across the way is the cemetery where she & family are buried.

Marriage of K & Pemmie
"K" and "Pemmie" married 18 Feb 1901 in Whitesburg, Letcher County, KY.
Their children included:
George "Noodlehead" Johnson (married Lizy Thornsberry)
Kanawha "Bush" Johnson (married Mindy Thornsberry)
Calvin "Snowball" Johnson (married Fronnie Johnson) -Calvin is still living
Estill "Son" Johnson (married Zella Bates)
Zettie Walker (yes, her middle name her father blessed her with was Walker) "Tudy" Johnson (married Andrew J. "Andy" Bates) -my maternal grandmother
William M. "Wid/Wedd" Johnson (married Lula "Luly" Hall)
Lettie Johnson (married Farris Bates)
Hattie Johnson (died 3 days old of "black arseptic" a blood disease that wasn't uncommon then; she was buried at 4 days old in cemetery where her parents are also buried)
Rosanna "Thomas" "Rosannie" Johnson (married Johna "Jack" Thornsberry).

Burial of K & Pemmie
"K" & "Pemmie" are buried at the far end, head of the holler on Bill D Branch at Kite, Knott County, KY.  To eventually find it, you turn up the holler, past the old schoolhouse and just keep on a driving. It's now a gravel road due to coal mining heavy in there now. Even when I was a young kid, we'd have to drive a vehicle down the creek part of the way up the holler.  You only went when knew creek was low. Now a vehicle can pull up around to a fenced area of the cemetery at what was the side of the cemetery. Used to you'd park where the road ends, where the houses stood, and cross over the creek via a tree felled or maybe a rough lumber bridge that would be dangerous & wobbly. There's a long line of their kids buried up there and it's filled in to a good sized cemetery now.
If you pass there when it's blooming with daisies smile and smell them but leave them for others to enjoy. Always made Granny's day when we'd see flowers in bloom around there -something alive up there.

This picture is as it was, blurred -it's not a bad scan.
Mom believes it is Grandma Pemmie (Angeline "Pemmie" Hall Johnson) and her sister "Aunt Caroline" (Caroline Hall and she'd married Bud Hall) as Mom used to go visit Aunt Caroline & Grandma Johnson. But then were not certain since Mom's legally blind not as easy one to make out for her.
Dad was asked and generally he knew the pics but on this one he was not certain.
If you have better clues, please share ideas.
This would have been taken early 1960s; one from Mom's picture files.

Thornsberry family connections of the spouses of children of K & Pemmie
Lizy & Jack are children of Marshall & Rosannie (Hall) Thornsberry.
Marshall is the son of Miles & Clarinda Thornsberry.

Bates family connections of the spouses of children of K & Pemmie
Farris and Zella are siblings, and a cousin is Andy
 Farris Bates and Zella (Bates) Johnson are the children of Tilden Tildon "Tinny" Bates & Martha M. "Sissy" (Hall) Bates.  Tinny the son of Washington Uriah Bates & Luanna "Pink" Hall.
Uriah & Pink had another son Joseph "Joe" Bates who married Margaret Alice "Mary Alice" "Babe" Vanover and they had a son Andrew J. "Andy" Bates who married Zettie Walker "Tudy" (Johnson) Bates.

Four Generations of Bates as well as four generations of Johnsons.
Back row, left to right: Carnelous "Cack" Bates, son of Zettie (Johnson) Bates.
Zettie Walker "Tudy" (Johnson) Bates, daughter of Pemmie Johnson,
and daughter-in-law of Mary Alice Bates.
Bottom row, left to right: Margaret Alice "Mary Alice" "Babe" (Vanover) Bates;
Brenda (Bates) Allen, daughter of Cack Bates; Angeline "Pemmie" Hall.

Obit of my maternal great-grandfather Caleb B. Johnson

Originally posted: Sunday, February 6, 2011 at 10:05pm on Facebook.

My maternal Granny Zettie Walker “Tudy” (Johnson) Bates had a little stack of obituary cards she’d gotten from attending many funerals over her many years of Earthly life.
In Jan 1993, I made notation of the printing of the one from her father:

Caleb B. Johnson
               Born March 1, 1872    
               Died March 27, 1966
               Services: At the home, 10 AM, Wednesday, March 30, 1966.
               Clergymen: Ministers of Old Regular Baptist Church
               Final Resting Place: Family Cemetery, Kite, KY
               Arrangements: Hall Brothers Funeral Home

This is the large picture that hung in the living room at Great Aunt Rosannie's house.
I always could stare at it for ages. Huge pic & so awesome that I was
able to see my grandparents Granny & Aunt Rosannie would tell me about. 
Caleb "K" Johnson (son of Caleb & Mahala Jestice Johnson;
their son William "Wedd" Johnson;
Angeline "Pemmie" Hall Johnson
(daughter of Sam & Lynn Johnson Hall.
My Granny Bates parents. 
"A picture of a picture I took of a picture."
I don't have a scanner hooked up to my new laptop
and my old laptop is in sad condition. I hope to scan
and get these looking a lot better to share,
but just had to post them since I ran across them.

Angeline "Pemmie" (Hall) Johnson & husband Caleb B. "K" Johnson. 
Note her converse sneakers -her usual style.
He had very, very poor eyesight always -if any of you knew of the reason,
please share as there are several descendants on this line
that also have similar problem in varying degrees.

Angeline "Pemmie" (Hall) Johnson & husband Caleb B. "K" Johnson. 
Pemmie is the daughter of Samuel "Sam" & Malinda "Lynn" "Linda" (Johnson) Hall .
K is the son of Caleb & Mahala "Halley" (Justice/Jestice) Johnson.

     Extra notes from me:

     It was common in that day to have the funeral at the home. And a man of the family would sit up all night watching over the person who had passed away. There is much lore behind this, and one that young kids like to learn about for school projects. I remember a few such as this, of course this was a couple years before I was born. If there was a person of my Mom’s family who died in KY –you knew first place to always figure going was Hall Bros in Hindman, Knott Co or Letcher Funeral Home in Whitesburg, Letcher Co KY.

     I had folks help clarify some of the original notes based on Facebook comments:  Hall Bros located at Martin,KY.  Hindman Funeral Services,Inc. and Nelson Frazier Funeral Home are the current Funeral Homes in Hindman,KY.  At one time Hindman,KY.also had a Casebolt,Hoskins & Cox Funeral Home and Knott Funeral Home.  Another noted that Hall Bros is in Martin in FLOYD Co., Kentucky.

     Noticing her necklace reminds me of Granny Zettie Bates jewelry (her daughter). She had a few pins/brooches that Uncle Herman, her son Herman Bates, would give her as Christmas gifts. She liked black glass bead necklaces. I have several old one's I've found around, taken to a jeweler to be knotted as pearls and always keep her close with the memory. No, she didn't wear any jewelry after she was a young adult and joined a church that didn't permit jewelry.  She did wear her wedding band and a watch in later years -I seldom recall her with a brooch on. Her ears were pierced, though. More on that later...

Notes from Knott Co KY Census Record 1910

Facebook posting 06 February 2011

Knott Co KY Census Record 1910

In August 1992, I reviewed records of this census with my maternal Granny Zettie Walker “Tudy” (Johnson) Bates.  First I will note the two entries, then I’ll make some “clarification” notes to assure that some family history buffs who are distant family know who’s really who on here.

124. Johnson, Caleb        age 37   married 9 years                 farmer

               Anazaline            age ?     4 children

               William M.         age 8

               Bettie                  age 5

               Estil                    age 2

               Letta                  age 5/12

142. Hall, Samuel          age 50   married 32 years               farmer

               Sinda                 age 57

               Martin               age 21

               Nevada             age 16

               Talt                   age 15

               Allice               age 13

               Maddie           age 9

               Mary E.          age 7

               Calvin             age 3

For 124 entry, the second entry Anazaline is Angeline “Pemmie” (Hall) Johnson. Her parents are entry 142. The census taker misspelled her name.

For 124 entry, Bettie is my maternal grandmother -Zettie, and Letta is her sister -Lettie.  The census taker misspelled their names.

For 142 entry, Sinda is Malinda “Lynn”.  The census taker misspelled her name. 

     There was no malice or ignorance of the census taker. The person would make a record based on whoever gave the information, and enunciation, and also the person hired to do the job writing education. 

     I always thought that Lynn sure was a fertile woman as she was in her 50s still having babies to raise. She also was a midwife who delivered many babies in those hollers.

     I note now that Zettie was 5 years old, same age as my youngest son. When she was that age, she already was doing so many chores that you’d never dream of having even a teenager do; but it was common work for all young kids back then –especially the oldest kids living at home. She could cook, do laundry (when there were no machines to do it), garden (not play, but work the crops), and by that age every child was a babysitter to the toddlers when a new baby was to be looked after.